CrossFit South Brooklyn

Established 2007

Comments

  1. I think the right rule on fighting:

    Don’t start fights. Finish them.

    I agree with the article. This whole anti-bully movement is a bunch of BS. Trying to get bullies to stop bullying through teachers telling them to stop and a bunch of other PC crap? Yeah I don’t think so. The only thing that will get a bully to stop is if their victim makes them stop.

    You might suspect I had some experience with bullies at school, and the “authorities” did jackshit. If I were strong and could kick their ass, that would have been a much better outcome. (I did try to fight back but I was weak and they just laughed at me.)

    Maybe that’s partly why I’m a libertarian, because its the bullies who end up in government.

  2. I do not agree with the article. I think that children should be taught that there are times in which it is appropriate to fight back (the abduction situation mentioned in the article) and then there is the majority of time when it is best to turn to an authority figure to help out.

    I teach at a middle school in the South Bronx where most of the children have the attitude the author advocates, and this can lead to a dangerous situation for all involved. My students are so primed to fight, they perceive threats where there are not any so others will not think they hesitate to fight back. They carry out these fights publicly to advertise their toughness. This has resulted in an environment which frightens students and has caused teachers to get bitten, pushed and hit in the course of this violence.

    Children must learn to trust adults to safeguard their environment to the extent that it is possible, or else we are dealing with a Lord of the Flies situation.

  3. Anthony and I busy doing Marine Corps stuff this weekend (bummer). We did yesterdays WOD this morning. The bear is truly a challenged doing 7 reps for 5 rounds is no joke. I think I Hate this Wod as much I as love it.

    Anthony- 65,95,95,115,135(x3)Finished with 95

    Michael- 95,115,135,155,185(x6). Almost pooped my pants on the last one, the just droped the bar.Look foward to seeing everyone tomorrow.

  4. My issue with the article is that little distinction is drawn between an extreme case of danger and a minor one.

    Proportionate response is what’s important. The article seems to treat fighting as an all-out or nothing scenario.

  5. It’s not about whether it’s “right” or “wrong” to fight — it’s about knowing how to defend yourself and understanding responsible use of force/self-defense.

    WOD: 8:28 as Rx’d, minus a couple DU attempts that I counted as reps in the first round. I found the WOD very frustrating mentally: sometimes I can string together 8, 10, 15 doubles. Then I get tired and try single-double combos, but that’s actually less efficient because I can’t get a rhythm. My goal for the end of the year is 50 unbroken DUs. I’m gonna beat that rope.

  6. WOD: 8:00

    my first set of pullups was kind of annoying, i neglected to chalk up so i was sliding off the bar halfway through, so I had to stop to chalk up. the next two sets were unbroken. my first double under round was good, 15 then sets of 5, the second one got hard, started with 10 and then tried to get fives but ended with threes. the final double under set, after getting 6 in, it quickly deteriorated to 3’s and then 1’s.

    children should not be taught to automatically respect authority. they should be taught to respect their parents and whomever their parents teach them to respect, but if you teach kids a blind obedience to authority you are well on the path to tyranny.

    most people in positions of authority are on the side of the bullies, the thieves, the criminals, the crooks. Back when I was in middle school I would complain to the “authorities” about the kids bullying me and they laughed it off, were buddy-buddy with the bullies, and told me I was making a big deal out of nothing.

    me? bitter? never. =)

    I think you only have to look at the current financial crisis to realize that the people in authority are on the side of the criminals, and are generally no different from the criminals themselves.

    (present company excepted, of course =)

    I agree with Max that proportionate response is key. You should teach your kids deescalation so that they don’t have to fight, but I don’t think you should teach your kids to rely on authority figures for justice. that is a losing game.

    for example in AZ when you get a concealed carry permit, it is made very clear that the responsibility to deescalate is much greater if you are carrying, because the consequences of escalation are very severe. Similarly, while I would not suggest that kids carry handguns, but if you teach them how to defend themselves, they become weapons themselves, so a part of teaching someone to fight is teaching them how to avoid fights.

    Avoiding a fight does not mean you go complain to the authority figure, because the authority figure is usually on the side of the bully.

    Relying upon authority figures who are on the side of the criminals is not the solution.

  7. today’s wod was 5:30 for me. didn’t feel great about this one, did first 21 pullups unbroken and then broke them up afterwards. wasn’t really feeling it, perhaps a few too many tasty beverages last night :).

    in other news, I used the rage gymnasts grips and didn’t tear my hands at all and am super excited about our impending order!

  8. 3:05. struggled on the second and third round of DU’s. not breaking the 3:00 mark was very upsetting to me.

    I detest violence. Learn to fight so you don’t have to.

  9. I subbed box jumps for DUs (worryingly, as usual; while I can get one DU at a time, I’ve not been able to string them together). I finished in 9:55, because, as usual, I fell apart on pullups. I started with a white band, and quickly had to move to a blue, and by the end, was doing pull-ups one at at time (and often got spotted by Sameer or David – thanks very much guys!).

    I guess there is no way out but through as far as DUs and kipping are concerned, so I’ll keep trying and hope it falls into place one of these days.

  10. Thanks to all who made it out for Burger Tour!

    Our verdict?

    Shake Shack was ok, touristy and over-rated.

    Stand, was awful in too many ways.

    Diner in W’burg was the clear winner. Best burger I’ve eaten, ever. Really.

    What made the day though was the crew of people who were along for the ride. Sammer, Jess, Paul, Becca, Shane, and Regan (first burger in 15 yrs for that girl, and she put it away like it was a timed wod). can’t wait to do it again.

    Cheers!

    In between ground meat and beer, there were rumblings of a Taco Tour. Anyone interested?

    First Sunday of the football season was a tough choice to start Paleo. Really wanting a beer.

    Yeah! Seltzer with lemmon!

  11. Warm-upDrank pint of Chocolate milk

    Double/Pull WOD

    2:44 as Rx’d

    All Pull-ups unbroken.All I could think about was the chocolate milk swishing around in my stomach

    uggg

  12. Very disappointed with my 3:38 time on this workout. Double-unders are a breeze, shoulder is clearly holding me back.

    Pullups were terrible — had to break them up into 7/7/7, 5/5/5, and 3/3/3.

  13. I believe that a kid should be taught to defend himself in certain circumstances. However, I have huge problems with this article. First of all, right off the bat Jeff Martin drags in a political perspective that I want no part of and he undermines his case while doing so. How is the country’s security threatened now by our belief that we should not defend ourselves? Huh? What place does that have here? It’s just way too broad a perspective to begin with. Secondly, he makes the same mistake that most magazine writers make these days, that is, he supports his argument with a couple of anecdotes from his personal life. How are these two situations, out of the billions that may occur daily, supposed to be compelling evidence of anything? So, yes, I think it’s important for kids to learn how defend themselves and, more importantly, when to defend themselves, but Martin’s approach to this argument is completely wrong-headed.

    Finally, there is a question of the personality of the child. There are plenty of kids who are just angry, and despite whatever philosophy their caregivers and their instructors try to enforce, their mode of defense is like a new toy they’re dying to use and show-off. So I don’t think it’s entirely out of place for teachers, counselors, day-care providers and whathaveyou to encourage kids to come to them if they are being harassed.

  14. Aaagh! How could I forget Stephanie?!

    Also, I spelled your name wrong, yet again, Sameer.

    I am a bad person. Steph and Sameer, please forgive me in time for the next burger tour.

  15. I’d be up for a taco tour. Will this be post paleo challenge?

    Some location ideas…CalexicoPinche TaqueriaOaxaca (on Smith)Multitude of places on victory blvd in Staten Island

  16. 7:20white band (or is it tan?) on pull-ups… did first 21 unbroken which is a first for me. 5,5,5 and then 5,4 for the remainder.Paul – thanks for the help and support!

  17. Great burger tour yesterday! As has been mentioned our next tour is already in the works. I’m thinking October 11 (my bday and the end of our paleo!). The taco tour sounds fantastic and agree with many of Sarah’s choices. What do you all think? We’d love to have more folks join us. And yes Sameer, we’ll still plan burger tour #2 somewhere down the line:)

  18. 9:56 with white band. Double Unders didn’t really click til the last round, but pullups are getting better.

    RE: Fighting: Kids should be taught lots of different options. Violence rarely solves anything. “When all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail.”

  20. i might forgive you chris! just make me a yummy paleo dinner and we can call it even 🙂

    only made one stop on the burger crawl but it was pretty good and fun company!

    wod today:9:42first round of DUs were a mess and a mix of singles and doubles. second round was 15-2-13 and last was all 18 strung together. pull ups were a mix of anywhere from 1 to 5 strung together.

    it feels like its been a long time since i’ve done a wod with pull ups in it. felt good. keep em comin!

  21. 7.52 as Rx’d

    got working out with ryan. double unders where pretty good, got 38 and 20 unbroken.pull up’s were tough as usual and broken. did some practice later, pushing off the bar and they felt better. got to keep practicing.

    acc wkack! thrusters 35/30lb. got to continue to work on those. and not running.

    re kids and ok to fight. i get pissed as all hell when lucy tells me someone hit her or pushed her. my first knee jerk reaction is to tell her to hit them back HARD. then i stop myself, as does my wife, and tell her to talk to the kid and tell them not to touch her. it usually works. the teacher also tend to jump in. that’s daycare. if it’s at the playground, lucy will tell the kid or i’ll tell the kid myself or their parent.the piece in the kids journal, the comparison’s were pretty extreme.with all that, it is important that kids know how to defend themselves in may ways besides violence.

  22. I think its useful to have a repertoire of defensive techniques handy (besides throwing punches) so that a potentially ugly situation can be defused. And sometimes, as the Humungus pointed out a long time ago, you should “Just walk away.”

  23. I completely agree w/ McGrath–self-defense is not the same as fighting. I think the author is right that we should teach kids to be responsible for their own safety–but hitting back isn’t always the way out. I used to work at a summer camp with a very similar atmosphere to Julie’s school, and she’s right, when you see self-defense as fighting back, you create a toxic environment.

    This WOD was extremely humbling (humiliating?). I had a rope that I didn’t agree with for the first round of DUs–once I switched I was much more efficient in a single-single-double pattern. Pullups were absolute crap, blue band notwithstanding. I need to get stronger–the extra 15 lbs of post-baby weight just can’t be the only reason I can’t do pullups.

    10:53. Gaah.

  24. So Mr. David and Mr. Shane – what’s the current tally on sleep??

    Taco tour sounds dee-licious – count us in.

    On the kids fighting article, I agree with Tamson and David McG. There is an enormous difference between a strange adult who is attempting to grab you and another litle kid who knocks you down. I don’t think the extension the author makes from the playground/classroom situation to the abduction case is well supported or sensible. His counterfactual for the Carly situation is not convincing either – It seems to me that running away could be a better self-defense when confronted with a powerful opponent, such as a full grown adult, not to mention screaming (i.e. drawing the attention of as much of the community as possible.)

    I agree with the author that kids should be taught not to be passive or allow themselves to be hurt, and I don’t think much of a teacher saying “oh well, little Tommy is unhappy, so we have to tolerate his behavior.” Such a story provides an explanation of Tommy’s motivation but does not make the behavior any less unacceptable. As a society we don’t forgive people their illegal actions simply because we can understand how they feel.

    Fortunately we don’t have a binary choice of strategies (find authority or fight) in the face of a threat and neither do our children.

  25. Samir: walking away is all well and good but what if the bully in question stole something that was yours? You should just walk away and teach them that they can steal from you tomorrow for no consequence? Or even in a different circumstance, suppose the bully beats on you in front of everyone in class, humiliates you, subjecting you to taunts from everyone else in class. then when you go to the authorities they tell you that you are making “much ado about nothing” (a direct quote, I might add.) ?

    There comes a point when violence is the only viable option.

  26. I like how Vincent puts it. Violence is abhorrent. Learn to fight so you don’t have to. I am categorically anti-fighting, but I’m sure most people who’ve been in fights will agree they aren’t violent per se. They were forced to fight. In fact it’s the most classic line of schoolyard excuses: “He/she started it!”

    I got beat up repeatedly in junior high. Telling an adult is certainly advisable, but the problem I had in a school setting, was that the teacher or counselor cannot permanently sequester a bully. My bullies just seethed and came back at me later.

    The better person to tell is other classmates. I’m not talking about forming gangs or creating a vengeance coalition, but I learned the most valuable lesson in self-defense as a tiny Asian person amidst perverts and wolves: Make friends. Lots of them. Make friends with the tallest, most intimidating people. Make friends with loud people. I stopped being bullied the second I went into high school rolling in with the tallest girl on the basketball team and the kid who did a karate demonstration at the first pep rally. Bullies aren’t afraid of adults. They are afraid of BEING bullied.

  27. I think the real take-away from the article is that teaching kids that it is ok to fight back is one way for a child (or anyone) to take control of the situation. Certainly there are other methods of asserting control, such as perhaps walking away. But teaching kids that they should relinquish that control to an authority figure would be teaching them a false lesson (Lauren i think that is Mr. Martin’s correct extension). The world is full of risks, believing that there exists more powerful forces that can mitigate those risks for you (or make fair the consequences of those risks, as Sameer points out is the problem with the financial bailouts) is foolish and irresponsible.

  28. I’m curious what those of you here who advocate running to authority would tell your kids if your kid tried that, and then the authority figure rewarded the bully and punished your kid.

    In case you haven’t been reading the news in the last twenty years, but the authorities are not on our side.

    maybe you didn’t hear about all the catholic priests having sex with kids? Maybe if your kid was getting raped by his priest you would suggest he should go tell the other rapist priest? yah, that would do a whole helluva lot of good.

    recently you may have noticed a purported non-profit supported by our government has been supporting child prostitution? Suppose your kid was being forced into sex slavery. would you want them to go to the people who fund the sex slavery operation for help?

    maybe you all think I am crazy now, but this has really touched a nerve. I am fairly disturbed by your responses.

  29. Our school has a simple rule: no hitting, and no hitting back. There are maybe 1 or 2 fights a year. At my old school, where the kids were taught from an early age to hit back I broke up one or two fights a day. Adults can totally affect bullying behavior with firm and rational responses… that’s why we’re adults.

    Box jumps for DUsand enough rubber to lift the Queen Mary II on the pullups7:48

  31. I should stop posting on this subject, it just makes me more upset, and look more crazy.

    Everyone appears to be claiming that if you appeal to authority that is non-violent. You fail to recognize that all state action is inherently violent, even if no actual violence takes place, because it is backed with the threat of violence. Appeals to authority are themselves violent acts. If the authority you end up appealing to is of the thuggish variety, then the cure is worse than the disease.

    I posted about this on my blog:

    http://blog.creativedestruction.com/2008/08/30/the-violence-of-the-state/

    don’t hide behind claims of non-violence when you invoke the threat of violence to get your way.

  32. 6:05 as Rx’d.Did this WOD in my old high school yard. Pullups were harder then expected (maybe I’m not used to the bar), so had to break them down (11/10, 8/7, 6/3), will try to do the WOD again when I’m back.

  33. http://www.wendymcelroy.com/news.php?extend.2725

    teach your kids to trust authority blindly and they will start to inform on -you- to the authorities.

    from the article:

    A few months ago, The New York Times reported, The Explorers program, a coeducational affiliate of the Boy Scouts of America that began 60 years ago, is training thousands of young people in skills used to confront terrorism, illegal immigration and escalating border violence — an intense ratcheting up of one of the group’s longtime missions to prepare youths for more traditional jobs as police officers and firefighters. The training, which leaders say is not intended to be applied outside the simulated Explorer setting, can involve chasing down illegal border crossers as well as more dangerous situations that include facing down terrorists and taking out “active shooters,” like those who bring gunfire and death to college campuses. In a simulation here of a raid on a marijuana field, several Explorers were instructed on how to quiet an obstreperous lookout. “Put him on his face and put a knee in his back,” a Border Patrol agent explained. “I guarantee that he’ll shut up.” The article features a photo of boys who look to be about 14 and are dressed in swat team gear, holding faux assault weapons.

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